Episode #1186
Many business owners and high-performing men in their 40s struggle to balance demanding professional careers, family life, and physical health. A frequent complaint among entrepreneurs is a lack of time, often leading to the assumption that fit, high-achieving peers possess superior genetics or an empty schedule. However, long-term physical strength and vitality are rarely the result of effortless genetics or extreme, force-fed daily routines. Instead, maintaining elite health while running a company and a household comes down to personal standards, long-term consistency, and sustainable habits.
In this conversation, Doug Holt sits down with TPM alumnus, strength coach, and former Scottish Highland Games professional John Oden. John shares his journey from an insecure, self-conscious kid to a world-recognized strength athlete, emphasizing that physical fitness was built through decades of steady commitment rather than natural advantages. The discussion examines how high-performing men often make excuses to justify falling below their physical standards, contrasting those narratives with the reality of building a sustainable lifestyle through life transitions, business challenges, and family responsibilities.
The episode explores practical strategies for busy men to maintain physical standards without burning out:
Rather than viewing fitness as an all-or-nothing project, businessmen can approach health as a foundational standard of identity. When a leader invests in his physical well-being through managing energy and physical capacity, he builds the stamina, clarity, and grounded presence necessary to lead his business and family effectively. By applying core principles taught in programs like The Activation Method and attending transformational experiences like The Alpha Reset, men learn to align their internal standards with their external health, ensuring long-term vitality across every area of life.
00:00 - Introduction: Balancing Business, Marriage, and Elite Fitness
01:21 - Debunking the Genetic Myth: John Oden's Early Journey
03:52 - Turning Insecurity into a Lifelong Commitment to Fitness
06:26 - Vision Boards, Standards, and Refusing to Let Your Body Go
08:55 - Overcoming Excuses and Raising Personal Standards
11:06 - The Importance of Mentors, Tribe, and Asking for Help
13:35 - Staying Curious and Continuous Learning in Coaching
17:09 - Adapting Fitness Routines Through Different Seasons of Life
20:02 - Navigating Divorce, Remarriage, and The Activation Method
23:56 - Preventative Maintenance and Don't Sweat the Small Stuff
26:21 - Doug Holt Mid-Roll: A Man's Guide on How to Save Your Marriage
27:23 - The 6 AM vs. 6 PM Mindset and Daily Rebalancing
29:31 - Minimum Effective Dose: Finding Time for Movement
32:27 - Building a "Courage Corner" for Frictionless Workouts
36:05 - Skill of Strength vs. Excessive Metabolic Burnout
40:35 - Identity Beyond Physical Appearance and Scottish Highland Games
44:30 - The Academy: Holistic Growth in Health, Wealth, and Relationships
48:43 - Overcoming Imposter Syndrome and Staying Curious
52:40 - Creating Your Environment by Choice and Closing Thoughts
How can a busy business owner fit strength training into a crowded schedule?
Busy businessmen can maintain fitness by focusing on the minimum effective dose rather than multi-hour workouts. Engaging in focused 15-to-30-minute sessions three times a week, utilizing simple tools like kettlebells, and setting up a dedicated movement area in an office or home allows for consistent strength maintenance without disrupting work demands.
What is a "Courage Corner" in fitness?
A Courage Corner is a small, dedicated space in your home or office equipped with basic, accessible movement tools like kettlebells, pull-up rings, or a mat. Placing workout equipment in high-traffic areas creates a frictionless environment that encourages daily movement snacks and consistent physical activity.
Why do high-intensity workouts sometimes fail for men in their 40s?
Constantly pushing through extreme, high-intensity workouts can overtax the central nervous system and cause physical trauma rather than sustainable strength. For men in their 40s, focusing on the skill of strength, proper movement patterns, and adequate recovery builds long-term vitality without risking chronic fatigue or injury.
How does physical health affect a business owner's leadership and marriage?
Physical health directly impacts energy, mental clarity, and emotional stability. When a businessman maintains high physical standards, he builds resilience and confidence that translate into better decision-making in business and a more present, grounded partnership in marriage.
If your marriage is struggling with a loss of love, respect, or intimacy, claim your copy of Doug Holt's book, A Man's Guide on How to Save Your Marriage Without Talking About It, to start taking massive action today. You can also discover how to assess your relationship dynamics and regain intimacy by watching the free video training at The Powerful Man Scales.
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John Oden 0:00
Looking for that next person who can help me.
Doug Holt 0:02
After I get past five minutes, I don't stop.
John Oden 0:06
What do we know about ourselves if we don't challenge ourselves?
Doug Holt 0:09
What about 15 minutes? Why don't we just start there?
John Oden 0:12
But we do need to take action. We need to take some level of risk.
Doug Holt 0:16
Develop your body holistically and make it sustainable.
John Oden 0:19
It doesn't have to be so force-fed, so hyper-focused, either.
Doug Holt 0:23
And that was by creation. It's by choice.
John Oden 0:26
You wouldn't do that to somebody that you didn't care about. It's because you care.
Doug Holt 0:41
How does a business owner run his marriage, run his business, all while maintaining the world record for the Highlands Games? We're going to talk about that because that's a real story by an alumni of TPM and a good friend of mine, Mr. John Oden. John, thanks for being here, man.
John Oden 0:59
Thanks for having me. Look forward to it.
Doug Holt 1:01
I'm excited about this. We talked about on the podcast and the show a little bit about my family being evacuated. So, wanted to publicly thank you again. You provided safe refuge for us, and it was actually a great time for you and your family to be that gracious. It just shows some of your character. So, want to start off with thanking you for that.
John Oden 1:19
Thank you. I'm glad you enjoyed it.
Doug Holt 1:21
Well, we did, we did. Well, a little bit about your background. I think that kind of sets the tone for a lot of what we're going to talk about today. You're a business owner. You have a wife. You have two kids and two dogs. Right, two children.
John Oden 1:37
Two pain in the house dogs. Yep, they're the greatest challenge lately. Yep.
Doug Holt 1:41
And so all while doing that, the common thing that I hear from business owners, well, any guys in their 40s, you're in your 40s. I'm in my 40s. I'm 49, so I'll be 50 next year.
John Oden 1:51
Nice.
Doug Holt 1:52
But the common thing complaint is, well, I don't have time for that. Well, John's genetically gifted, and therefore, or John just has tons of time and nothing else is going on in his life. And I've gotten to know you really well after, over the last almost 10 years. Almost been a decade.
John Oden 2:09
It's been 10 years. I was just thinking about that too. I was just driving over.
Doug Holt 2:12
Yep. And you're just as busy as anybody else. You've got, and we can talk about, you were gracious enough to say that, you know, you've been through some of the TPM programs and some of the events. In fact, you are going to be running an event for men coming up here in just, just a month, which is crazy to think about how fast this is coming.
And let me ask you the first question: Are you just some genetic specimen that you just get up in the morning, you don't have to work, you don't have to do anything, and everything comes easy to you?
John Oden 2:41
No, not at all. The, you know, the easiest way to, I guess, deconstruct and, as, as you know too, things were some of, sometimes in life, right, the things we're good at or things that we've just been doing our whole life or just transcend that, right, on that hierarchy, right? It just is hard to, sometimes hard to articulate. It just is. It's just, just your being, your identity, whatever. It's, it's, it's all that.
But specifically the genetic side, not at all. Look at, look at my family. Look at my, my DNA. No one truly, like, no one is really fit. I'm one, one aunt on my mom's side. No one's over six feet tall, so maybe I'm not. They're not my real parents or something. Milkman, huh? They turned out to be six two, and no one else. My family's taller, but to specifically, I've been leaner. I've naturally been a leaner, like more of a true hard gainer, if you want to call it that, or the 98-pound weakling in some ways.
And, and mentally, I guess the, the other side is I was just so self-conscious as a kid. You know, not to get into all, all the childhood challenges unless you want to, but I just was from, I think back, and I actually just watched the new He-Man movie. So, like, we had no chance. You were right in that era too, but it was all the, the Hulk stuff, He-Man, all the action figures, GI Joe, like everybody was just Jack. So it was just like, I want muscles, you know.
Every kid says that, but it's just like I kept, kept saying, I kept, you know, obsessing over that, begging my parents for the plastic cement covered or some, or plastic covers cement weights and just the whole stigmas of it. You are going to hurt yourself, or you are, or, but, you know, pretty cool to have found that at such a young age and, and made that my lifestyle.
And it's cool how popular it's become now. It's just so mainstream. Where what I was doing even into my, you know, early 20s or my degree program, my background in exercise physiology, it was not cool. It was not common, put it that way. Definitely not for older people or aging and weight training and doing these unique lifts and things like that.
But, in a nutshell, I was not muscular. I was not really that strong out of the box. Maybe more twitchy, more explosive side of things too, and then really, it's just my, it's just that long-term commitment to consistency. I just think that strength training or strength and being lean, being healthy, like, it's just shows how much you've been consistent for so long.
And, like, you know too, I've, I've never let myself, once I turn the page from my professional Highland Games career. I was a, you call me like a true pro for four years, and then I dabbled with some other things too. So I pushed my body up from the, you know, 160-pound high school graduate, and just didn't, didn't do any sports at the end of, of high school. Just didn't, didn't take it seriously. Didn't have the mindset, and just didn't feel like I had the body or anything too.
So it just came, came back slowly in my mid-20s at that time. When most guys, like, oh, I guess the body's just kind of going to be how it's going to be. But again, to that kind of question, it was choosing my degree program and deciding at least I'm going to enjoy going to school for this. At least I'm going to enjoy working with. I'm helping people. I'm doing these things, so I just built my life around that, and decided I wanted this, you know, just manifesting that just slowly, or just like some of the stuff we did in the TPM exercises, or I remember at The Alpha Reset building that and going, and I've actually assisted at a couple resets, as you know, too.
But just people, like, I've been, been on both sides of it too. Been a, in the coaching, assisting role too. So really cool to see where we're building that.
I forget what you call it, but the, the whole map of what you want, the vision, whether it's for, you know, done them for the day versus for the weekly or the, the whole life you want too. So it really does. You have that vision. I've done vision boards and that too. But I'm always, always that thinking man, you know. Sometimes to a fault, but it's just deciding what you want and putting that as that priority, at least in that category. Right? We can have it in other areas, or we can have it, but we can't always have it now. It's just shifting around.
Of course, we could go into all the different scenarios of life and business, but something I'm really proud of, just through injuries, through divorce, through moving, through being broke, through being whatever, like, I've never let my body go, and I've just been, I guess, obsessed with that. I just said, I'm digging my heels in. I'm not letting this go because if I let this thing go, I know my mind. I know, you know, I'm always feeding, feeding my, my ego, my feeding, feeding myself with knowledge. I'm always learning, so I'm always putting that around me and surrounding myself generally with healthier people, and just has provided. I've just created that environment, just like a right environment for the, the garden to grow or whatever you want to call it too.
Doug Holt 7:33
Oh, I love that. So at TPM, we teach this thing called one destination, two paths, and so the idea behind that, the reason I shared that is oftentimes for men, it's easy to, on your way towards your destination, we call it the Powerful Man. Some people could call it success. Whatever it means for you, we see guys can look across at you and go, "Ah, he's on steroids. Ah, it's easy for him. His parents were probably Olympic athletes and fitness models," and they make excuses to make themselves feel better.
Now they do this in money, success, and business. "Oh, he's got a great family. Must have da da da." They make the excuse. "Oh, he's looks like this. He must be gay," or whatever, whatever it is. Right, right, and so that's why I wanted to tell these guys, our guys are listening. You know, it's not necessarily easy for you.
And the way I look at this, John, is standards. So when I take my shirt off and look in the mirror, I have to deal with the reality of my own standards, right? And am I falling above, below them, or do I even care, right? And am I prioritizing, like you said, you've been broke. Almost all the, the guys, guys in our Inner Circle, which is our highest level mastermind group. I mean, these guys invest significant money and time to better themselves.
And when I ask those guys, I go, "Hey, do you have rich parents?" They just start laughing, right? And their standards of success in the area of business are extremely high, and they've been broke. And if they get broke again, they're going to go right back up. Just as if I know you've suffered injuries in the past and, and all kinds of other things. When you have setbacks, which takes most people to say six months to recover. Maybe it's an Achilles injury, rotator cuff.
John Oden 9:23
Totally true.
Doug Holt 9:24
You go right back because your, your set point is what we see now, which is fit. Because, you know, my joke with you has always been, like, you know, you used to do videos and pictures and you'd send them to me just to, as good friends do, egg me on, try to motivate me and kick me in the ass, which I, which I definitely need. But you'd be drinking a beer with a six pack.
John Oden 9:47
And knowing, having that kind of camaraderie, which I think is lacking in men. Are, it just seems so immature, or like, oh, you're just, you're, you can't offend anyone, you can't. That's another topic in itself too. We can't. The teasing, wrestling stuff is just so, so fun, and of course you, and you're the same. I know you well enough too. You're only doing, you wouldn't do that to somebody that you didn't care about. It's because you care, and that's just so obvious to us.
But it's just, I won't tease. I will be very, I think, very kind and very approachable, and realize that, that I do carry this bigger presence, bigger body, whatever, and why? And that's another topic I think worth exploring a little bit too. Is, like, I'm not out to be. I love when somebody says, "Oh, you're not. You don't seem that whatever high intensity with the Highland Games." I've had people say that, which you, you see the other side too.
But I am a high, high intensity, high, high rev kind of guy, but to have people at least be able to naturally fit into that too, where I have, you know, say an elderly client or something I'm working with too. That, oh, you just, you're so downed with you. I don't see that intent side of you. I don't see that aggressive, you know, that, that athlete side of you in that way. So I think that's a nice compliment.
And I wanted to touch on too that it, I didn't do it alone though. At the same time, I just was determined, humble, whatever. I just didn't take no. I just keep, keep going. I'm doing that now with track and field coaching. I'm in a humble enough place where I'm not an elite track and field coach, especially. And I can talk about the Highland Games and the parallels in that too.
But some of the, you know, working with high school kids too, you get such an array of, of kids, and, you know, I do think that there's hope in the world for, for kids and, you know, young adults in this era too. But just asking for help, being, being humbled and being willing, and I can just see that more than ever with any level of people. They're asking questions, they're paying attention, they're showing, of course, just showing up, right, and, and look, looking for that next person who can help me along the way, or I can lock arms with and, and share.
In, you've been a big influence mentor of mine, and we've been able to have that symbiotic back and forth with the, the fitness coaching support and that versus my business, and just kind of the overview of, of realistic life stuff, and, and obviously through TPN too, realize you're not, not alone. As, as cliche, cheesy as that might sound too, but you're not alone, and that having a, a tribe, having a group around you, and not just, don't lone wolf it, don't just completely go, go it alone, at least not for very long.
At least recognize, hey, I will call myself out, even say that voice or the, all the other good, good men I've met through TPM along the way. It's like at least I know that voice is up there. I see that little, you know, side of me, that gremlin's talking to me or whatever. Like, okay, at least you know you're lone wolf on this for whatever. But we're not doing that for long.
You know, you, you were gonna get back on this too, and that's like you said, just that transcendence of things too. I'm just able to get, get back on the horse quicker, and my challenges too. And other, other areas are through the, through the pandemic and all the business shutdowns and challenges and new life immersion stuff. It's been, been a ride for sure. So it just come back around to what we really value in deciding, you know, we're going to do it. Let's, let's get after it, or, you know, the do or do not attitude, right?
Doug Holt 13:10
Well, and I love that. And over the 10 years that I've gotten to know you, one of the things I've always admired is when you decide you're going to do something. You go after, one is you go after it. You don't half-ass much. The second thing is you all, you find, you look for the best coach, and you, you, you hire them. I am going to guess, knowing you, you harass them until they allow you.
John Oden 13:35
Or tell me to screw up. Exactly. I mean, can't think of the last time that's happened. But, again, that, like, in the track and field world, I'm thankfully, I know enough people that have connections along the way. It's just cool how when you keep, keep doors open or you keep open mind, but you don't have to completely, you know, I can take it in stride a little bit more too.
But I, I get to go to this elite throwing camp. This, it's called Ironwood, and having a good friend out there who's coached at the Olympics several times in that too. It's just like, wow! I keep. It's not a coincidence that it keeps happening. You know, talking to my family about that, saying that to you right now, like, it gives me goosebumps.
Like, whatever I do, I'm, I'm got stuck for a while too. I hit my whatever you call it midlife crisis or my point of like, well, what do I really want to do? I'm still enjoying these things. Thankfully, I have too many passions, but also, like, a certain, that readiness or willingness to go after it too. But now it's like, boom, it's just all firing again too.
And, and that's on that end of things is the track and field coaching, competing myself, and then saying I'm going to go out here and I'm going to learn as much as I can, do this immersion camp, and just keep gathering information. Just, just keep heading down those roads, and it's, it's just whatever that is. Finding, finding those resources and having a good filter, having a good awareness that I'm not just jumping on the showy shiny things. I'm digging, digging, and, you know, asking the right questions to the, to other people or to myself. Where to, where to take this, or where, where is the most effective path to whatever I want to do, you know?
And having someone else in, in business or life and, and marriage, it, at least we're rebalancing. I know you talk a lot about that too. It's, it's never really completely balanced in all of the quadrants of life for very long. If it is, it's almost like, okay, what's, what's going on here? This isn't supposed to just be perfectly harmonious all the time.
We're rebalancing and shifting, changing expectations, and that's where having my wife along the road to having family members, have good friends to keep, keep me balanced. Obviously, that I don't always need to go after that full on right away today. I can chip away at it more so now in some ways too. I don't have to, the FOMO of like, I got to do it now or I got to go to this camp now this summer. If I don't do it, I'm gonna fail as a coach or something too. They're not gonna hire me on next year, whatever.
But it's been a great new, new kind of re, same, same base, same. The principles are the same. The foundation is the same, and how I'm doing it. But knowing that, that, that I guess it feels like a cheat code, but just a realistic roadmap or a, just a foundation that I can refer back to.
At least I, I, that makes me want to put that into writing or put it, put it out in some kind of format to, to help others too because I, I think it comes natural to a point to people, but they just must flutter in and out, and you probably touch on that too, how, how the, how most people's minds work with all these cool ideas, get excited, and it's like, just back down here. Like, okay, I know you really, part of you really wants this, but you just don't see that journey, and that's what I get to do basically all day long with my clients and people, just helping them get, get unstuck or be realistic.
And I love doing that mindset stuff more than ever. Where, okay, here's what that, here's your, where your patterns were. Does that realistically fit there, or what, what can that just realistic goal setting and, and the behaviors around it obviously has got to be, got to be there. You can't just have this crazy, I'm going to work harder. I'm going to go harder.
Like, no, maybe when I was 25 in some ways, but I know better. I know I can do it again. Maybe more slow and steady, more methodical. Or it's got to be some times when I'm, when I'm willing and able to sprint, and other times when I'm not going to fall, and that's the same with fitness too.
I don't let that, on any given week, shittiest week of my life, I'm still, I'm going to go to the gym and do something for my body because that's my grounding pad or that's my happy place enough, or, you know, go, go, go move my body, right? Doesn't have to be. Believe it or not, I'm not a hardcore typical gym guy.
I had a very healthy fear of the gym, respect for the gym, and I'm, I'm not the guy that wants to go and be the bro stuff too. I, you, you know my facility and my philosophy all around too is just much more quieter, you know, more connection out there in, in the woods, more nature oriented and lifting stones, doing, doing stuff like that.
But it's got to, you know, to stick with it. It's got to, got to resonate enough. It's got to be something I enjoy. You know, and clients too. Obviously, I coach that way. I'm not going to force feed somebody to lift kettlebells or be married to one thing. But, we need to load our body. We need to move our body in rhythmic ways to get our conditioning and be prepared for life, obviously, right?
Doug Holt 18:23
I mean, so I want to talk about the health and fitness side of things, but before we go there, because you are a world recognized strength coach, I'm going to use strength coach as a blanket term, right? I like it in the fitness industry. A strength coach is a specific kind of genre, and you're much more well-rounded. So I don't want to paint you into a corner. But people in the fitness industry will know what I'm talking about.
Those watching this, you know, industry wide, you, you, you do a lot. Someone who was in the fitness industry for decades, it's easy to know the difference between someone who knows what they're talking about or someone who just looks the part. So we'll go into that and give everybody tips because everybody wants that secret pill, right? Including myself, you know, going through it, still looking for it.
But most of the men watching this or listening to this, depending, and guys, you should flip over to YouTube and check this out. It hasn't always been easy, and you were nice enough before we came on to kind of talk a little bit about that part of your journey, or offer to talk about it to give some other men some possible hope going through there.
So you mentioned just a little bit ago you went through a divorce. I knew you during that, that trial and that period of your life, which was, was not easy as it is for anybody. I mean, even people I know that had quote good divorces. Don't wish it on anybody to go through it. And you're now married to a beautiful woman. And I say that both inside and out. You know that the person that married you was humble and also good looking.
John Oden 19:53
Exactly. Best investment, best decision you can make, or worst decision, right? Let's. Decision, if you can, if you're going to go that route.
Doug Holt 20:02
And so I was lucky enough to marry you and, and your beautiful wife. And that was true. It was an amazing, amazing time for me. It was. I felt very blessed.
And you went through The Activation Method, right? And I bring this up, one, to highlight the fact again that I share the story so much. I've been coaching for so long that everybody thinks it's easier for the other guy. Right. And they don't know what someone else is walking through in their journey. Men that have gone through our programs get it because you show up and you are like, "Oh, you said I am not alone for sure." And you are going through, and so you alluded to why don't people do something?
And I think it's the gap between, we call living in the gap. It's, it's where you are today, or where they are today, versus where they want to go can see so astronomically long that they don't see that you just have to stick to the path of the method, and that's why we call it The Activation Method. It's a proven methodology.
So you went to The Activation Method, and then you went to an Alpha Reset. I remember you walking in the door. I actually helped co-lead your Alpha Reset. Yep, which was awesome.
John Oden 21:10
It was a lot. Yep, big, big leap. Even knowing, and knowing you was a big, big factor for me for sure. To be like, oh, this man stuff. I wasn't, wasn't gets. I, I've always enjoyed being maybe more open, vulnerable with other men, but not like, okay, full immersion or this online idea of it, and then, okay, we're going to this.
And I remember not, not exactly breaking down, but in my way of spinning out, let's call it, and talking to you, I think probably left you like a 15-minute Voxer message or whatever. I was in New York, and I just, like, overbooked myself with all these things. And I don't remember exactly what you said, but the essence was this: this is a great time. There's probably not going to be a better time for you. This is, this is a great time for you to do it.
It wasn't, wasn't you need to do it now or else. It wasn't that, that FOMO side of things, or negative side. It was just like, you're, you're ready for this. Just if you, if you hang on and trust me, you're gonna get through this. And just, and it's a, it's cool to look back on that. Like, okay, that is truly that idea that, like, the hardest thing you've ever done is the hardest thing you've done, or the, I've gone to this level. Can I go there again?
And have a better idea. I learned from that what that takes to get there, and again, I think that should, should or naturally, the framework or the, the fundamentals are there, whether it's business or fitness or whatever. Those, those key pieces are there, and again, like we've, we've been talking about, it just, it just made enough sense, and it was, it was a great time to, to take on all those areas because it just, at a different point in my life, I didn't have the relationship. I didn't have the, the house yard, the two, two pain in the ass dogs, that, that stuff.
Where now I'm in another shift of like, okay, I want to up a level more, and I'm happy to talk about that too in, in business and, and my other deeper passions there too. I, outside of a marriage, but I don't want to. My wife and I both, we don't want to screw it up. We don't want to go out of too far out of our comfort zone or our, our pattern.
But realizing it's, you know, it's, it's our time where we're very ready. We're both very parallel with that too. With her, she's an artist and she is an entrepreneur herself too, and, and teaches workshops and that, so we have enough parallel worlds. But our kids are old enough now too, where they're a lot more hands off. I'm realizing, cool, I'm doing my part as a stepdad, and that's a wonderful, very, very challenging piece of my life too, as you know.
But there's not as many things have quieted down. Our home renovations, our business paths, it's, it's pretty, you know, steady. It's, it's smooth, relatively. It's little things when you look back at the day or the week. You're like, that was really not that big a deal. It's just, just silly stuff that is annoying, right?
Doug Holt 23:56
There was a book I read in my 20s. I actually listened to an Audible. I remember I was at the running on the beach in Santa Barbara. Maybe it was in my early 30s, but anyway, it was called, the title I thought was interesting, and I love recommend the book to everybody. And it's, it's nothing you don't know, right? Any good book I find is almost all things remembrances.
The title I believe was "Don't Sweat the Small Stuff. Dot dot.it. all small stuff." I love that book. Okay.
John Oden 24:22
My mom gave it to me, like, in my early 20s, and I kind of were like, "Is this? Is she trying to tell me something?" She totally was trying to tell me something, of course. But, it's a very easy read, just fun book to refer back to.
And it's just, I remember really just like, on the day you die, you're gonna still. It's like you're gonna have that checklist, rake the leaves, do this and that. And my wife's very good at reminding me of that. Like, who cares about the yard, or who cares about those things too? So, at least to have that happy place to go to.
I, you know, we got to maintain it. You know, I'm such a preventative, you know, maintenance or the stitching time save nine. I don't. I don't think he says that anymore too. But doing the preventative stuff, I big on. That too for forecasting, for foreseeing. You know, I'm not a all knowing seer or something like that. I don't think too, but I do think I have enough grounded sense of what, what it's going to take to get to that next level.
And that's probably where a bit where I'm stuck. I'm over, overthinking it in some ways, and like, okay, just like as you've told me many times, or giving me permission in a way, just go. Like, dude, you're, you're not a wild random person that's gonna just fly off the handle or spend way too much money on a new business project and just be like in dire straits or something because of that financially or just feeling so crushed by that. You know, sure doesn't.
But we do need to take action. We need to take some level of risk. We need to be aware. When are we really in that? I like. I think it's what's it called? 6000 weeks, something like that. I think it's from that book. There's a few books I read around that same time, but it's all about that awareness.
I kind of lost my train of thought for a second, but that level of awareness of, of what, you know, where we are in that moment, what it takes to get to that level, you know, is, is it worth doing that next challenge? We only have so much time, but we don't want to be so gung ho that we're throwing it all out. It's, it's a certain pace and different, different parts of our day, even, right?
Doug Holt 26:21
Hey guys, I just want to share something with you. I'm sure we can both agree that in order to fix something, you need to know what's broken, and, and not only need to know what's broken, but a step-by-step methodology on how you can fix it. That's the easiest way to do it, right? Otherwise, you're going to be toiling with things.
That's why I created a free training, a training that only shows you how you got to where you are, where your relationship is missing that love, respect, admiration, and even intimacy that it used to have, to how you get it back. How do you retain that? Where your wife's looking at you the same way she used to look at you when she said, "I do."
You know, I don't know about you, but for me, when my wife looks at me like I'm her man, that I feel like I can conquer the world, and I want that for you. Simply go over to thepowerfulman.com/scales. That's thepowerfulman.com/scales, and I have a free video training for you. You can just click play and see if this resonates for you. Now back to the podcast.
John Oden 27:23
We've talked about that a fair amount of time, or you've mentioned, like, the, the six a.m. Doug and the 6 p.m. Doug, and I love two different. I love that too. I'm like, I have my version of that too. There's enough. Like, why? What if they just got it, got along a little bit better?
That high intensity and, like, it does, it does temper itself. They do have to come to balance too, and that's where, again, having great people around us, good wives next to us too, that are, that are strong in their ways too, to deal with our, our strengths and willingness and need to go, go seek, and that's obviously huge part, again, in TPM and just in life.
Men just, whatever that saying is, start, start dying, like something. They start dying at age 27 or whatever too. It's just the, the don't let the old man in. I love, love that one too. It's just I'm starting to, to realize at that point. I can totally see where it's like, I'm just, maybe I should just kind of take it a little easier.
Even last night, just thinking like, ah, been a hot day. I've been coaching all day. I had a clinic I was teaching. I'm like, I'm genuinely smoking. I'd already taken, you know, giving myself permission to take a little nap break. I'd refuel, blah blah blah. But I'm like, I'm feeling pretty beat up and tired.
But, you know, my wife again said, "Why don't we go down to the river and go, you know, jump in the river? It's hot, hot day and everything. Go have a little mini date, but it's like we'll bring your track spikes and we'll, you can go do your hill sprint. Like, I'll totally do my thing while you're doing that," or she does it with me half the time too.
But it's like, there's a nice, like, little half step in there too. It doesn't always have to be, I need to go to the track for an hour. I'm already smoked and tired, and then I'm not going to enjoy, or I'm going to be spending too much time, or I'm not going to enjoy that time with my wife too. I'm cutting that off, and it's like 9 o'clock at night, and like, oh, now, now we both have time for that.
Well, what if we take a break during the day, or we go on, you know, date your wife during the day? That version of her too. You always see that 9 p.m. version of your wife, or that weekend version of your wife, right? I think that's worth talking about, you know, in that sense.
Doug Holt 29:21
Well, I mean, we just described as the gap I was just talking about, right? So you're tired and you're thinking, well, I have this perfect track workout I'm supposed to do, right?
John Oden 29:31
It's all on paper. It's all, I get strict regimented, but I'm, I'm give myself a lot more push and be, be lighter with that and realize, like, I'm still making profit. I'm still heading towards that primary goal. So that's been great too.
Doug Holt 29:41
But there's also the minimum effective dose, right? And, you know, so your wife Kelly, you know, goes up to you and goes, "Hey, let's just go to the river, bring her spikes." Yep. And you're like, "Okay, sure. I'll just, you know, if I do it, I do it."
Kind of the idea when I was a strength coach, I used to tell guy people, "Hey, just check in the gym. You can walk away. All you have to do is scan your card and go." Turn around, go home.
John Oden 30:00
Totally.
Doug Holt 30:01
Nobody goes home, right? But even, you know, this is something that when I was talking to you about my mobility issues, right, and we're talking about exercise snacks, and then you were talking about the preventative part of you. Just even when I get down and do some basic movements, after I get past five minutes, I don't stop. Right? It's that five-minute window for me of getting warmed up, like on my shoulders.
John Oden 30:29
You're in your right mind now. Now you're not the real, authentic Doug shows up.
Doug Holt 30:33
I don't know if you know this, but I started doing jujitsu. So—
John Oden 30:36
I thought it was kids doing it, but dude, now you're. Oh, I signed up too.
Doug Holt 30:40
Oh, they, they do a class for adults at the same time, and as soon as they did that, I jumped in and makes total sense my shoulder injuries and everything else. I'm still in there. Erin's, my wife is like, "I've never seen you happier." I'm like competing again, right? Mano imano, something about that's awesome.
Brother story, and I'm happy to touch on that in my part of my journey as well. But back to you, and I want guys to think about this. I get it, you get it, but that, that minimum effective dose of, hey, just do something.
Like if you're talking about fitness, you know, you and I've had this conversation. So something I've learned a lot from you. Again, being in the fitness industry for so long, you can get into a stigma, if I already know all this shit, right? In any industry. And then you've taught me a lot more about kettlebells, clubbells, things that I wasn't as introduced to. More of what people, some people would call the Eastern Bloc or Russian style of fitness that's become popular in the U.S.
And now recently, I had some guy ask me about kettle. Two guys ask me about kettlebell training, which I love to talk.
John Oden 31:39
Not a, it's not a trend. No, it's proven itself.
Doug Holt 31:42
It's in. It's in. But you encouraged me to do the simple and sinister, which does not take much time at all. No, and will wipe you out if done correctly with enough effort and force. You know.
So again, I want to let the people know it's not like you're spending eight hours working out, right? There are, there's levels, and even if you are, even if they don't have an hour, right, or 45 minutes, or whatever it is that you work out. I love it. What about 15 minutes? Why don't we just start there?
You're sitting across from a guy. We're gonna call him Derek. Okay, he's interested in kettlebells, interested in a bunch of things and doesn't have time. What's the minimum effective dose for Derek?
John Oden 32:27
Assuming he's talking general, general fitness, at least maintenance, and he wants to touch on some other little.
Doug Holt 32:33
I'll give you his background. Sure, he's a business owner. Wants to look better naked. Wants to be somewhat more functional. Maybe interested in kettlebells, sounds cool. Doesn't have a lot of workout experience. No major injuries.
John Oden 32:47
Well, I touched on the, on the diet. We'd ideally spend more time in there and then sleep and, you know, all that boring stuff too. But from a movement side of things, I would also want to probe into a bit. What do you do at a desk all day? Can you get a anything?
I'm not a huge fan of, like, the treadmill. Those came out, you know, years and years ago, and they've shown that's not that effective. But what can they do to set up their work environment? So many work environments, and I worked in employee wellness, and really love seeing how much this has become mainstream.
You know, working the hospital setting, and it was always like these little ways I could help employees and do. I did ergonomics education and all, all this different cool stuff around the hospital, a little kind of little bit everything within the hospital setting. Got to go around and do all these little workshops, so I kind of knew everybody in the hospital, and I'd get to run around all, all day long sometimes like a chicken with my head cut off, but that's another story.
But to, to dig into that specifically, it would be definitely resistance training would be the focus, and I would tend to lean towards kettlebells. But could he have a little, we call it like a courage corner? Could he have a little area in his office or something he can get down on the ground? Pain corner, the pain cave or whatever. Could that fit at the, at the very least?
How can you make it so approachable? I used to call it. I call it sticky. You literally, like, have to walk over the kettlebells or walk over the mat to get down on the ground. Or again, like, if it's like a Tony Robbins quote, I think in there too, with, if you don't have 10 minutes to yourself, you, you don't have a life, so, you know. Get up 10 minutes earlier to, to a point. Hopefully, you went to bed early enough too. But get up and do some movement there.
There's the one little box. So if that's, if I got minimum, like, five minutes there, and you get him to go outside, maybe he's got a dog and he can go walk the dog there too. Go, like, I, you know, have my ring pull-up thing. I walk down to my yard, and I'm gonna do something probably on the rings where I'm hanging and doing a few pull-ups.
Sometimes it's gonna be a little high intensity. It's just, it's almost like my brain just rolls a little dice that it fits into one of those six categories. Like, hey, I'm just doing totally fluid movement, focus on my breathing. I'm just, I know it's gonna be a busy, stressful day versus going, I'm feeling great. Go and knock out max effort pull-ups or something like that. So I have that built in.
So I would, you know, put that in his, his routine. And I totally get it too. Like my daughter, for example, she decided to join a gym as much as all of her family. She has, my wife has a gym or courage corner at her studio too. So she used to go there or train with us and train. Now she's 18, and it's great to see her wanting to go find it on her own too.
So, and sometimes I feel like that way too. Going to a different environment, going and finding that. So it could be, you know, joining a new gym, but I wouldn't say doing something that's across town, 20 minutes away, blah blah blah. It's got to be something that fits that you're excited about, at least within reason. It's got to be close enough by where you're going to go do it or sign up for a class, that kind of thing.
But I would say as little as, as 30 minutes, three times a week would be better. I'd rather see that probably than two times a week for 45. But that could be, be fine because we could, as you know too, with, with kettlebell training, we can smoke ourselves. And I'm always about that skill of strength too. We can authentically get stronger. We're not trying to combine it all.
John Oden 36:05
And I know, say, good CrossFit programming or any good coach, they're not just slamming people through these metabolic workouts all the time. If they're a good, good coach, and that doesn't only works for so long, you're not really going to get strong. You're not really going to get lean beyond a point, and it's just, you're just traumatizing your body at some point too.
So how can we do that? And again, check those boxes with something where we're authentically getting stronger. Measured. I'm always about having some metrics, some measures in there with any client, whether they, they like it or not, realize it or not. To something that, that's meaningful in there that we can have a pushing pattern, pulling pattern, something where we're carrying, squatting, deadlift, you know, hinge pattern. Something we're having some measures in there, and we always had those baseline standards, as you remember.
Our empowered standard in the gym is just like living a base empowered lifestyle. You're able to do everyday stuff, and you're not generally going to be the weakest link unless you're full of fitness pros and that too. You're, you're gonna feel like I'm definitely better than average. I'm, I'm well on my way versus that game changer standard. That's like elite athlete or someone whose optimization side of things. Here's our, our strength levels, and they're not, none of them are crazy either.
And then we have obviously conditioning in there too, and some other odds and ends with kettlebell, like more of a simple and sinister test as a swing test or a kettlebell snatch test, where we're touching into a lot of it's the mental challenge, which I will fully admit, doing the, the high intensity, just looking at that for my prep for backcountry elk hunting coming up in September too. I know I need to, to enjoy it, to do it safely, to do it effectively. I get to go and push my conditioning, push my cardio. Realize I'm going to, you know, which I'm not trying to get leaner. I'm going to lose a little bit of top end strength. I'm going to not have the time to do the power thing.
So, anyways, back to our guy. What's his name? Derek. Derek. So three. Three times a week, and then hopefully combine it with any family time or kid time, wife time, go for a walk. You know, ideally go for a daily, daily walk, and then maybe in the evening, that's something I've got a lot more back into. Is in the evening time, have, again, mat, have a place you can push the table away, do your Netflix and chill.
But I'll be, without being too annoying to my wife, working everything from grippers to, I'll be doing a little self massage on something. I'll bring, bring the gun out and I'll be working on something. I'll get down on the ground and just move around a little bit. And she's maybe not as into it as I am, and some of it she'll laugh at a little bit too. But she's obviously very much on board and totally knows I'm a whatever evil genius mad scientist. I'm never. I'm never gonna stop. And why would, you know? That's why she married me too. She knows you're not.
And I love saying that too. Half, not even half joking, but, like, you're never gonna have a broken down, completely broken down physical. Even if I completely lost all my physical ability, got paralyzed, God forbid, I'm gonna find a way. Like, oh well, I can still use my left eye. Maybe I can still shoot my bow, or maybe I can go do. I'm gonna find a way, and I love those stories. Everybody's inspired by those stories, but I'm like, and I ask my wife, Jenna, like, do you think, I can't remember what movie we're watching, like, do you think I would, I really be that guy, like, going through what this guy's going through on the show? And she's like, absolutely, like, that's you. Like, that, just, you know, hearing that from her, and no, already knowing, knowing it. But then, like, another level, really capital knowing that, you know, whatever comes at me, I'm gonna find. I'm gonna fight through it. I'm gonna hopefully just, you know, you and using my mind. I could talk about that too.
I've had many of those moments with enough injuries and realization and time, and I think intelligent, maybe wisdom or awareness to say, okay, what, who was John when we strip all this physical stuff away? I love that. Or basically being, I'll say, semi-retired again from the Scottish Highland Games. I don't care. Like, if you, if people want to talk about the Highland Games, fine, but I'm not going to come in the room and tell you, tell you all the things I've done. How much I bench or all this fit stuff, they just, they just know, they just see it and they're like, you're a fit guy.
Like, I'll even wear more baggier clothes and stuff too because I don't, I don't want the fitness guy to just lead all the time. If that makes sense, I never 100% probably like, oh no, that, why would you not? I want the fitness guy or whatever, but that's just, just who I am all the time. I, I want to be, you know, just the depth and well-rounded, and knowing, like, there's a, the mind's going very strong too. And I, from reading and learning, I'm, I'm never going to be bored. You know, God forbid again if something extreme happens and I'm physically limited. You know, on that side of things.
Doug Holt 40:35
Well, that's, I mean, it's coming. It's identity. No, it's identity. And that, and again, I go back to standards. Your stand. You have standards in every other area. Fitness is just an obvious one, right? Because you can see it, right? You know when someone's fit and when's not.
John Oden 40:48
Got it. For me, it's, it's esthetically. Yep. It's, it's less. It's more objective that way. I know. Did you, you know, hit the, the target or not? Did, did we meet that objective? Did we get, get to the goal? And sometimes some of that more ambiguous stuff is, is harder to say. You know, am I, am I there? Am I doing enough? Am I doing, you know?
And in marriage and relationships, we could definitely, you know, that's a lot harder. And my, you know, definitely my standard there is, is my kids, my mom. You know, I have a smaller, true close knit family as, as family, you know, life's, life's changing with deaths and that too. I don't have as, have as much of the close true closest, but between my wife, my mom, and kids, that's my ultimate standard.
Maybe, you know, a few close friends that, hey, you're, you know, you're enough. That was another key resonance, and I know other men like you. You're not just, just you showing up at or your best, whatever that is for the, for the day or the week or the year. You know, you know, and, and you just, when you feel that, just hold on and just, that's enough. You know, you're doing what you're meant to be doing, and showing up for us. And hey, we like you for just who you are.
They know what they're getting. There's not, and I'm not one to hold, hold back. I'm not one to, to pretend, and they know that I'm going to be authentic. I'm going to whatever, call, call, call people out or the, the Irish uncle. I like that phrase for it. Meaning, you know, that guy, people haven't heard of that. That's going to, going to be willing to have tough conversations. Going to walk towards the danger, whatever you want to call it. Too.
It's, it sounds, you know, kind of glorified that way. But I like, I like the chat. I like being challenged. I like pushing out challenges, and that's part of being a good coach too. What else can we do? And sometimes that can come off if somebody's not ready for it, or our kids aren't ready for it. Well, I'm not enough, or you're. When is it ever going to be enough? You know, that's a sometimes a tough pill to swallow.
But then, if I can, you know, usually shift it back into a good, good, healthy place. Or for them, just understanding what I'm meaning too. Like, I see potential. I'm this, like, this king of just seeing people's potential. Like, oh, there's, you know, you could do this, this, and this. But I know the worst thing I could do is say, "Oh, Doug, you can be, you know, 180 pounds. You can go do this, this, and this." And we're just, just blasting you with all this fitness rate, and you are like, well, we weren't even talking about that, or why are, why are we even going on that realm versus where you are with your health.
And that's what I love about just being involved in TPM too as a coach now on, you know, fitness as my primary, but being able to or having easier willingness, let's say, to go into the others. It's always a holistic side. There's always understanding, meeting, you know, meeting them where you are, whatever you want to call it, where there's awareness of, of their, of course, their goals and what their vision, and can we push out a little bit in an area, or maybe there's a huge area that they're not aware of that potential. I love bringing that out.
And I, again, as a young athlete, a young person, I did. No one gave me a roadmap and said, "Oh, you're going to be super fit guy. You're going to be world record holder. You're going to have championships." And I didn't know my superpowers or, like, our good, good friend, co, co-coach in TPM on the fitness side of Front Sidman and talking about the superpowers and the Kryptonite. I, I've always loved that. I've always used those phrases.
What, what do we know about ourselves if we don't challenge ourselves in, in ideally all areas? So I love that part of my. We'll just say the second half or the rest of the journey is more of those other, other life areas too that aren't so physically driven. I'm, they're all, the physical one's always going to come, come back and come through, and come around. But the other, other areas that I get to do, get to develop. So.
Doug Holt 44:30
I mean, I love it, man. It's constant progression. And so, for those that don't know, you and Franz are the two lead coaches for something we have inside of TPM. We don't talk about it much. It's called the Academy. The Academy is a four-level progression for men who have gone through our other introductory programs, have the opportunity of enrolling in.
So it's about a four-year, just like a university that goes through self, health, wealth, relationships, and business. And four different levels to get men to kind of what most men think of as the ideal version of themselves, and one of those categories: fitness, health. Right, so it's not just fitness; it's the holistic. And you guys lean that.
In fact, I alluded to this at the beginning. And one month from now, here at the TPM Ranch, we're at. So for guys that don't know, TPM, we have a 106 acre ranch. We run events. We've been doing this for over a decade, so it's not like we just threw up a website and decided to go for it. This is something we're passionate about.
A group of men are going to come. It's going to be guys going to arrive Thursday. It's going to be Brotherhood, and we're looking at like 12 guys. We're trying to keep it really small, and then Thursday, excuse me, Friday, Saturday, it's full days of education on how to. I mean, I want to use my terminology, but so I will. How to weaponize your body, right? How to use your. How do you? How to learn how to develop your body holistically and make it sustainable.
So guys walk away with no fluff. I mean, you're on Instagram, TikTok. I mean, you are on those as an influencer, but I'm talking about the Derricks of example, and they're going, okay, this guy has got this workout. I'm gonna try that. Oh no, that person's got, and it's, it's too much. It's paralysis by analysis.
So the idea is these 12 men are gonna show up to the ranch. It's gonna be friggin' fun, and they're gonna learn everything that, the real no BS stuff. We were talking about that before you, before we hit record, and you're like, no, I'm, you know, I'm not, again, you know, I'm not for these quick fixes. They just don't work.
They sound good on a podcast, but the reality is the fundamentals, and people just don't know the fundamentals, and so that's what they're going to be learning, and they're going to walk away with a full expert assessment from you and Franz. How to do the exercises? How to actually do a kettlebell swing? I'm, you know, and, and I've taken, I've gone with and worked at a camp with you guys, which is phenomenal.
And so you're doing all of this as kind of the next evolution of Mr. John Oden. Amongst other things, and it's a holistic encompassment of what you're up to, and I love seeing it, man. I love seeing the growth for you and pushing yourself and being willing, what you just did. Being willing to admit, like, hey, there was a time in my life where I didn't feel like I was enough, or I didn't know. And I think every guy feels that, but they don't feel, they don't think any other guy's going through it.
John Oden 47:22
Exactly. Fully, fully agree.
Doug Holt 47:25
And you look at you from the outside. I mean, I know you really well. Your business looks good. Your body looks good. You know, you look like a tough guy, right? You're a big freaking teddy bear. But you look like a tough to me. It can be. Keep it on that side. I don't want to get on the other side. Let's put it that way. I also know that other side of you. I know it exists.
John Oden 47:45
Enough to not. I don't take, take shit from anybody.
Doug Holt 47:48
No, I'm not as fast as I used to be. Right. So, you know, with that being said, nobody would know that. I mean, I remember at your Alpha Reset, some big stuff came up for you that you worked through and were able to transgress. And nobody would know that you were going.
I'm sharing this because I get so many guys I talk to are like, I, if I was the only one. I had a guy not too long ago crying and pulled me aside and goes, "Doug, I have a condition," and I was like, "All right, well, what is it?" "It's called imposter syndrome," and I go. I just start laugh. I couldn't help myself. I go, "Everybody's got imposter syndrome. Everybody. Everybody questions whether they're enough."
And then to see you transcend that, and I'm sure you dip and come out, has been an amazing part of my journey to witness for you. And I love how you provide that for the guys through the, and you use fitness as your vehicle, right? Exactly. Help them get there.
John Oden 48:43
And that's just the way I describe it too. It's like I have that awareness, that, that extra little guiding light or force or voice, whatever you want to call it, filter for reasonable things to bring me back to what matters and what's foundational in, in all areas much easier, much faster.
I don't have to ruminate. I think so many people spend so long on that without getting the support or try, try and do it online or, like you talked about the fitness world. Now we're on the other side, and I think people are recognized that and through the AI tools and whatever, but when I started, there was so little information. It was literally me getting on the internet. That was my hell. Yes, that I knew this was for me. Is just scouring the internet, and I joked, like, I read everything out there. I pretty much did.
Like you too, we get the old journals. You had to get physical stuff too. There's so little good information and, and to filter that. So I just, I dove into everything in my right after high school actually too. I finally said, okay, let's, the skinny guys got to go, and boom, boom, boom.
I think we're. I still looked at so many other, you know, doing the right thing for my parents, doing the right thing for the life, and you. To have this very, what felt like, you know, super stable safe job, and I realized, like, wow, that was such BS too. They just, they didn't know what they didn't know. They came from a different generation. There was not a good entrepreneurial mentor, you know, in the family that way too.
And I just encourage people to diversify and stay. I mean, I could talk all day about the stay curious, stay. That's part of the huge answer I've decided, at least for staying youthful. Is, are you still asking questions? You're still curious. You're still willing to be whatever you call it, vulnerable in some cases, or just put yourself in a new situation and keep enough of an open mind.
I don't think people, it's easy to say, "Oh, I have such an open mind, or I'm, I'm up for anything." Like, well, what have you really done in the last week, month, year, whatever? And even looking back at myself, it's, you say I haven't done that. Like, this year's been kind of flat, kind of like my wife usually, because my, on the other sounding board on the other side is like, no, you've done this, this, and this. Like, you've, you've done these things that are parallel enough, and she can see, thankfully, for the most part, or I'll convince her how they all line up, or how, you know, almost to a fault.
Like, what's the next business opportunity? And I know you're, you've helped bring that out too. That it's a creative side. It's a, it's a side, and I, there's nothing wrong with enjoying making money doing what you do, but then sometimes you, you can lose some of the joy of it too.
So shifting in that, and I had enough of a, I don't even know if I told you a lot about that too. Enough of a crisis of faith in, in working in the fitness industry. I was like, ah, so many people just don't want to do anything, and all this new technology, they're just so lazy, and I'm so bitter, or I'm so whatever, and that was part of basically getting that guy to go away or sit in the corner, kind of thing.
Like, I, if I'm that, that judgmental, that short sighted, and, and I need to change the populations I'm working with, change my expectations, because I set the bar very, very high, and I still very proudly, as, as you talked about in sense too, who I'm willing to work with, and lots of front end questions and, and questions along the way to say, is this the right fit? Are we still meant to keep working together? Because I want to see results. I'm after your results. You're paying me for the results, not to just babysit you for an hour and go through the motions, right?
So I don't know where I was going with that, with some of the life stuff too. But well, you're circling back around through, through it all too.
Doug Holt 52:26
We've had this conversation a lot. You and I have, and TPM's the same way. We have an application for guys to come in. I work because I like it, not because I have to. You work because you, with the people you want to work.
John Oden 52:40
That's a good point.
Doug Holt 52:41
And that was by creation. You know, it's by choice.
John Oden 52:48
The, the shitty side of working in the, you know, broken hospital system and, and doing all the things where you're just feeling so limited, oppressed, like you follow all the, the corporate pieces or the whatever, going again, pleasing your parents, pleasing all the other things.
So I, it's like I, I do know what it feels like now to go too far the other way. Like, sure, take it like screw this. Unless it's like, it's just this, the standard is so high. It's just this elite, elite, elite. And, you know, again, you encourage me. I mean, that voice is in my head. That true, like, red, red velvet carpet stuff too.
But there is a point where you can say, "Well, you know, I don't. I could, you know, feels like a compromise where I can consider this and, and reevaluate it too. I could some of those things." There's, there's hidden pieces within that, or having a challenge to bring you back, you know, to a little more humble ground or something.
Finding, you know, finding meaning in anything we do too, or try to eliminate that stuff, or again, having much more of a stable, solid financial platform to be able to say in abundance. This is really, or I don't, maybe I don't need to be here. Maybe I don't need to keep this relationship around.
I also am not one to give up. My friends and family always say, "You, you never really give up, totally give up on somebody. You're always at least willing to invite them back in, have a conversation." As much as we all go through challenges and, and push back and whatever too, but coming back around and saying, okay, I don't need to completely be black and white with this too. There, there can be some, some flex and flow into, into the day.
There's things that are gonna have more meaning. If that makes sense, that don't, that it's not on the surface because I'm so action objective. It's purpose driven. You know, what's the purpose of everything I'm doing? Like, sometimes you can just go out and go for a walk, and you might run into something cool along the way too.
Sometimes that's more, maybe again, maybe more youthful, curious side of me, saying, "Let's just go, go with the flow and explore a little bit more too." You're not one to just get too far off and be, you know, laying in the grass, just enjoying the view for too long. You're going to find the right, right way for you, and I think that's a great, great to whatever. The less is more, and the. A little bit lighter, not the, the grind gung ho.
I think people can go too far with that and death of the dreams. Oh, no, I don't want to work that hard now. I don't want to do this. I don't want to be like, no, don't. That's the don't let the old man in. And, and there's an enough in there too.
And there's, you know, we can talk all day about different seasons for that, seasons of the year for fitness to, to rise up and, and business things, and if we can have at least a, a bit of a vision and do some forethought planning and strategy with our, you know, other men in our lives, our men mentors, our spouses for sure too.
And my wife and I do that, you know, very proudly. We plan and knowing that we're at, that's a obviously a very good sign in my mind, at least, that we're on a much, much more abundant, higher level thinking. We're not day to day in our, our lives so much, unless we want to. You know, having that spontaneity is still great, of course, too.
But where we can forecast and we can start thinking, where do we want to be? More the, it sounds boring too, with like the five year plan. Where's the five year vision excitement? But it can be, right? We're like, oh, but that's more the corporate kind of ladder, typically, but not the way I'm trying to say it too. It's like, what's this? What's this next event? Part of the adventure you look like, and you know that when we got married too, she just like, I'm never gonna be bored with you.
I know that, and most, that's the like 27 year old guy. That's the marriage all over and over again in TPM too, of the guys that are, are slowly dying, or they've let their fitness go, or they've let their other areas go, and I guess I've just again come back to no matter what, I'm at least going to keep some level of, of fit body, and not necessarily right or wrong.
I guess I just looked at it more like if I don't put my own mask on, on the crashing airplane, I'm not going to get my oxygen. So I just reverted back to that. But other guys will, of course, commonly pour into their business. Maybe some, in some ways, I guess I poured more into my marriage. I guess I'm again really proud of that, but also proud there's much more this next level emerging of very excited about all the next entrepreneurial pieces or working with guys, you know, like I'm doing with, with TPM and with the high school and athletes and coaching at a little different level there too, and that, that evolves just without trying too hard.
Put it that way, it doesn't have to be so force fed, so hyper focused either.
Doug Holt 57:19
I love it, man. Well, man, thanks for all you do. Thanks for being here. I'd love to bring you back again and talk about the levels of the power standards, as you call them, and other things. Let guys know, and I think there's a lot for guys to digest here.
John Oden 57:32
My pleasure. Great stuff. Enjoy it.
Doug Holt 57:35
Gentlemen, as always, say in the moment of insight, take massive action, and you got a lot here. John has shared the ups and downs. He's been through The Activation Method. He's been through The Alpha Reset into The Brotherhood, and now he's leading men through fitness to how to change your body. But he's also just like you, right?
And so often I see, because I've been doing this for so long, working with 1000s of men, and I used to coach women too. Is it's so easy for us to look at somebody else and say, "Well, it's easier for him because," right? He's got a successful business because his dad must have given it to him, or he's got a great body because he must work out all day.
And I'm just gonna offer that that's just an excuse to make you feel better for you not being where you want to go. If you want a goal, you get to go after it. If you're a member of the TPM community and you're interested in finding out what John and Franz are doing, just leave a comment, and they are in there. They're active in the community, and you can find out whether it be the this fitness event or whether it be something else in the future.
These guys are world class experts, and John's sharing his life. Look, look, you find a challenge, you be decisive, and you go after it, and that's how you get to the next level. We'll see you next time on the TPM Show.