Episode #1074
What happens when success on paper doesn’t match how you feel inside? In this episode, Bruce shares the quiet crisis he faced in his 40s, one that wasn’t loud or obvious, but deeply personal. He opens up about the years he spent hiding behind work, accomplishments, and a polished image, while quietly carrying a weight he didn’t know how to name. Through honest conversation, Bruce and Tim unpack what shame really is, how it can quietly shape your life, and why so many men struggle to talk about it. This isn’t about fixing everything overnight, it’s about being honest about where you are and starting to move in a better direction.
You’ll hear about Bruce’s journey from pushing people away to finally letting himself be seen. He talks openly about what it took to stop pretending and start connecting in a real way, especially with other men. If you’ve ever felt like something’s off, even if everything looks fine from the outside, this conversation is for you. It’s real, it’s grounded, and it might be the nudge you need to start showing up differently. The goal isn’t perfection, it’s authenticity.
You don’t have to do this alone. If you're ready to stop carrying it all by yourself, we put together a free training that walks you through the exact steps men are using to get unstuck and take their lives back. No pressure, no fluff. Just a clear next step.
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Bruce 0:00
And I won't quite say my life fell apart, but I certainly had a crisis going on in my 40s.
Tim Matthews 0:05
For some men, it cost them their life.
Bruce 0:08
There's something so inherently bad about me I don't want anybody to know.
Tim Matthews 0:14
The freedom to be yourself is just priceless.
Bruce 0:18
So guilt is I've done something wrong. For me, shame is I am something wrong. Nobody rejected me. I always lived a fear of being judged.
Tim Matthews 0:40
Hey guys, welcome to another episode of the TPM show. My name is Tim Matthews. I'm your host, and today I am joined with Mr. Bruce Greater.
Bruce 0:49
Good to be with you, Tim. It's great. How you doing?
Tim Matthews 0:52
I'm doing well, thanks. Looking forward to this.
Bruce 0:54
Me too.
Tim Matthews 0:54
Me too. Candidly, this is the first time we've met in person.
Bruce 1:01
It is indeed. It feels rather strange because it kind of we had so much interaction online. Here we are.
Tim Matthews 1:06
So who knows where this will go?
Bruce 1:09
We'll see.
Tim Matthews 1:10
But I'm used to that. Doug throws me into that all the time. Oh, I've got one. It's record. Let's give the listeners just a little bit of an insight into your role in TPM. And then we can kind of go into what we want to talk about today.
Bruce 1:24
Sure. Thanks, Tim. So I joined TPM just over a year ago in a fractional role as a fractional Chief Financial Officer, really supporting the owners and the Chief Executive to bring some kind of financial insight to the business, support them with some strategic financial thinking, some oversight of the financial function, and kind of really just being kind of the old guy who's been around the block a couple of times and brings a little bit of experience to businesses of a similar size and background.
Tim Matthews 2:01
And on that note, share with listeners a little bit of your background, sure, in men's work in particular.
Bruce 2:07
Sure. So before I got into men's work, I was very much focused on career, finances, business, and I would quite say my life fell apart, but I certainly had a crisis going on kind of in my 40s. It wasn't working for me, all this money and being on television and on the front page of the financial newspapers, and so I guess I went through a period of a lot of deep personal self-reflection. I was talking to a therapist at the time, and he suggested I do a weekend with a men's organization, a volunteer kind of charity men's organization. I said I'd never heard of that, but I was game for anything, particularly as it was kind of six months away, but as the time got closer, I thought, what have I done? What have I done? And it was an intense weekend experience through the Mankind Project. And I won't say it saved my life, but it certainly changed my life. Wow, it kind of woke me up a little bit to what was more important in my life, showing up with authenticity, showing up with some vulnerability, making deeper connections, particularly with other men. And through that, I met some great men, some men that I could be authentic with and connect with in a way that previously I just kind of shown up, you know, with the beer around the barbecue, which never fulfilled me properly. And through one of those men, one of the TPM coaches, I met more TPM coaches. And roll on the story a few years, and here I am working for TPM.
Tim Matthews 3:59
Beautiful. Thank you. Tell me a little bit more about what was going on in your life during that period when you said it just wasn't working for you. What was going on and what wasn't working?
Bruce 4:11
So I had had a very successful career. I think I was very focused on not wanting people to see who the real me was, living with a bit of shame around who I was, but I didn't know it at the time. So I showed up in the workplace as highly successful. I was running a global technology fund. I was kind of one of the best performing investment funds, mutual funds, unit trusts perhaps, in the world at the time. Massive inflows, great performance, and everybody was going, wow, you're doing a great job. And I was kind of showing up as this kind of great guy, but inside me, I knew it wasn't me. So I devoted myself to work, to studies, I guess, as a way of deflection. I didn't want people to see who the real me was. I didn't particularly like myself, and I didn't know why, and so that kind of fell apart a little bit because it wasn't the authentic, real me. And so I looked at ways of exploring how can I get out of this deeply uncomfortable place I'm in through that, through some kind of therapy, through some coaching, kind of working in men's movement, which I kind of love. It's really made a difference in my life. So I stay involved in some volunteer work to make a difference in other men's lives because, frankly, it made a difference in my life.
Tim Matthews 5:39
You okay if we dive a little bit deeper?
Bruce 5:41
Sure.
Tim Matthews 5:42
I know this wasn’t where we intended to go.
Bruce 5:45
I’m mindful we’re probably not going where you intended this to go.
Tim Matthews 5:49
This is perfect. This is perfect. Like I said, it’s the first time meeting, so it’s, and I think there’ll be guys listening to this that will very much resonate. And I’ve been in periods of my life when I felt very similar. Anyway, I’m curious, I’m just putting myself in your shoes. You’ve started to become aware that, hey, things are not working. Typically, for a lot of the guys that come to us in a similar spot, they start to do various things that we would probably consider self-sabotage. So I’m curious, did you start to act out, if you will, in any ways?
Bruce 6:32
I guess I did. So some of it was around my health, not eating as well as I used to. I stopped exercising, I kind of put on weight. I would never describe myself as an alcoholic or an addict, but I certainly had some addictive-type behaviors of maybe drinking too much at times. Kind of part of, you know, one of the boys, that’s what we do, that sort of behavior. Not looking after myself properly as a way, I guess, of a sort of self-soothing, numbing myself.
Tim Matthews 7:18
Like a sedation.
Bruce 7:19
Absolutely. Absolutely.
Tim Matthews 7:22
And did you have kids at this point in time?
Bruce 7:25
So it kind of overlapped with when I had my kids. So I’d had this really successful kind of early part of my career, and more or less at the same time my first son was born, and then three years later my second youngest son was born. So it kind of overlapped. And here’s the really interesting thing, my children brought so much joy and happiness into my life. They really were probably one of the biggest gifts in my life, if not the biggest gift to me. And yet, at the same time, there was part of me that didn’t like myself. So it was a sort of transition of, I don’t like myself, but here are two young sons who bring me the most amazing joy in my life. And I think that was probably the crossover when I realized the way I’d set up my life wasn’t working for me, and I wanted something different. So that was the early start of a sort of journey of self-discovery, of self-awareness, of starting to show up more as the sort of man I wanted to be, being a little bit more vulnerable, being more authentic with people around me, saying what I wanted to say rather than saying what I thought other people wanted to hear from me.
Tim Matthews 8:45
When you say you didn’t like yourself, what was it about yourself that you didn’t like?
Bruce 8:52
I think what was going on for me was the recognition that I was a gay man and I never wanted to be. So there was an element of self-loathing that I was something that I didn’t want to be. At first, I thought it would be a phase, it never was a phase. So the growing awareness that that’s who I am, and that’s who I didn’t want to be, caused me some shame, frankly. And that shame led to some self-loathing, and I hid it. I hid it from the world until I couldn’t hide it anymore. That’s probably it.
Tim Matthews 9:29
I mean, regardless of what it is, right? What the reason is, I think the idea of pretending to be someone that you’re not, I know I’ve been there, and it’s really difficult because so much of, I’ll speak for myself, so much of my life was set up to look a certain way and to function in a certain way that the idea of me being someone different, the cost of that, like, what will people think? What will people say? And a lot of the men we work with feel the same way. Somehow, it’s like a very slow boiling. It’s that whole idea of putting a frog in a pan of boiling water, it’ll jump straight back out. But if you boil it one degree at a time, very slowly, it’ll just stay in. It’ll stay in and eventually die. And I think that’s very akin to where a lot of the men are when they come to us. They’ve just slowly, over time, began to be someone that they aren’t. And it’s this inauthenticity.
Bruce 10:49
Completely. So that was absolutely what I experienced. And I saw it around my friends, work colleagues, they thought they had to show up in a certain way. They had to be this confident, successful, “I can do this” kind of guy. And sometimes they had a bit of self-doubt, or that’s not who they wanted to be. And the personal struggle I saw in myself, and now recognize in other men, is that they were putting incredible pressure on themselves because they thought their wives, their families, their employees, their customers wanted them to show up as this kind of confident, successful, “I can do this” kind of guy. And it was a struggle for me. And I see it in other men around me, everywhere I look, you scratch a little bit, I see it.
Tim Matthews 11:41
I mean, for some men, it costs them their life, right? There’s something, suicide is the number one killer.
Bruce 11:51
I’m getting goosebumps as you say that, Tim, because there are three men I know who’ve ended their lives. I wouldn’t say they were, one of them was close to me, the two were kind of in my circle of friends, and their lives could have been different. But they were going through a crisis, and they didn’t know where to turn. They didn’t know how to get out of that. They thought there was no hope. And I see it beyond just my circle of friends, it’s the number one kind of killer of younger men generally. And it can be different. And yet, I’ve never been there myself, but talking to people, it’s hard to imagine there’s a way out of that deep, dark hole.
Tim Matthews 12:35
Shame, isn't it? Toxic, toxic shame that just wears so heavy and builds and builds and builds.
Bruce 12:43
And the thing about toxic shame is nobody wants to talk about it. They don't want to talk about it, and so it festers and brews in the dark, and there's no release.
Tim Matthews 12:53
Let's just break down that idea of toxic shame for a second, because I think there'll be guys that'll be listening, sure they won't necessarily understand. So just describe what is toxic shame.
Bruce 13:05
So let me do a comparison. The way I like to think about it is between shame and guilt. So guilt is I've done something wrong. I've stolen a chocolate bar from the shop as a kid. I've done something wrong. For me, shame is I am something wrong. So there's part of me that is inherently bad. That, for me, is kind of shame, the difference between guilt and shame. So I start to take on a belief about myself that I am, as a person, bad. Toxic shame is a level deeper than that. For me, there's something so inherently bad about me I don't want anybody to know. And that's kind of it. It's the thing I want to keep away as a secret from everybody. I don't want anybody ever to find out about this evil that is within me. That, for me, is kind of toxic shame.
Tim Matthews 14:03
I think you've described it really well. I'm just thinking about the power of men's work, right? And toxic shame. And I'm making some assumptions, I'm guessing really about your experience when you said about men's work, but I've got to imagine that your experience of doing that Mankind weekend and men's circles and men's work things really helped with the shame.
Bruce 14:27
Exactly, exactly. So for me, the release from shame, or the recovery from shame, is two things. It's shining light on it and, secondly, talking about it, so not hiding it. The more I can share my journey with shame with other men, and the more they can share what's shaming them or the shaming beliefs they have about themselves, I think the better. I'm reminded of a conversation I had a couple of years ago with a young man. He was in his late 20s, perhaps early 30s, and he said, "Bruce, I've read every book on shame I can because I live with an enormous amount of shame." And I said to him, "That's great, but now you need to start talking about it." And he was like, "No, I don't want to." I said, "That's exactly why you need to start talking about it."
Tim Matthews 15:18
There's so much light in the dark.
Bruce 15:20
Exactly, exactly.
Tim Matthews 15:22
So much light in the dark. And for me, that was one of the most profound experiences of my life, was coming clean on things and sharing things. It was hugely healing, hugely.
Bruce 15:37
So I always lived in the fear of being judged, and yet, when I shared kind of what was causing me to live with so much shame, nobody rejected me.
Doug Holt 15:49
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Bruce 16:41
In fact, they were more welcoming and accommodating. So the response was often, "Bruce, I'm so glad you shared that with me. Now I know you better." And it's such a nice,
Tim Matthews 16:54
That's the thing. It's the connection that grows in the humanness, exactly. When someone's willing to be vulnerable and drop the mask or take down the guard, they provide the other the opportunity to really see them. And it's in the authenticity that the connection can take place. I think that fear of rejection and judgment just really makes a lot of people, men especially, just hold on to these stories and hold on to the toxic shame. And the more they tell the stories and the more they reinforce it, the more the mind then looks for ways to prove it to be true, and the worse it gets.
Bruce 17:32
Exactly. So I didn’t realize at the time, but I was crying out for healthy connection with other men, and yet I was holding myself back from that because I wouldn’t show up. And in the showing up, I got that healthy connection.
Tim Matthews 17:48
My mind goes to the recent event we did in Napa Valley on the Inner Circle days. So the Inner Circle, for the listeners who don’t know, is our higher-end mastermind, where the guys invest almost 100k for the year, limited to 15 guys. It’s a very intimate space, and the guys in there, there are two guys in particular that are new to the group, and one of them had just sold his company. I think definitely mid-eight figures. I’m tempted to say 100 million, but I don’t think it was as high as that. But his whole thing was how lonely he had felt for his entire life and how he was craving connection with men. And again, he didn’t realize it until he had it, and then he was saying, “Oh, this is what I’ve been missing, the honesty, the vulnerability, the ability to be challenged, the ability to be supported, and within all of that, be completely accepted as well.” And it’s the same with all the other guys in the room. They often say that they’ve never experienced as much acceptance from another group of men who they very much respect as well. These are titans within the business world. These guys are movers and shakers. So to actually share the darkest recesses of the corners of the mind and the soul with one another, and like I said, to be accepted, it’s incredibly freeing.
Bruce 19:22
Absolutely. So that’s what I found by doing men’s work and surrounding myself with similar men, is how much lighter I feel. I can show up as me, and I also know that if I mess up, I’ve got some kind of deep friends who are going to hold me to account and say, “Bruce, you said X and you did Y. Time to tidy yourself up a bit.” These people hold me accountable, and I can do the same for them. And through that challenge and accountability, the opportunities for deep connection are very real. And they’ve given me a lightness about my life now that I never had in the past, a sense of joy. Even when I’m working hard or have had a tough, challenging day, to know that there are some people who may not be in the room, but I just know that if they were, they’d put their hand on my shoulder. That is very powerful for me.
Tim Matthews 20:25
Man, it’s hugely important. Hugely. I love where this has gone because it’s very much gone along the path of authenticity, right? And I think about your journey and the first half of your life, if you will, you start to realize there was some inauthenticity going on that fed then some shame, which then resulted in you realizing, “Hang on a minute, I’ve got all the external things that would mean I should feel successful. Hang on a minute, why don’t I?” And you started to question it. And then the journey of authenticity that came about from that. And then you talk about the lightness and the joy and the connections you’ve made. What an incredible journey.
Bruce 21:13
It’s been incredible. I mean, I think there’s a writer called Hollis who does a lot of, he’s probably a Jungian kind of writer, and he speaks, which absolutely resonated for me, about the first half of a man’s life being the outward journey: accumulating success, being seen. And then the second half of his life being about the inward journey back to an authentic self, back to kind of showing up as who he is, rather than who he wants or thinks people need to see him as. And that’s probably, I don’t know where I am, but I’m probably on the return journey, rather than the outward journey.
Tim Matthews 21:56
Now, I see that a lot in the men, a hell of a lot in the men that come to us. That first half, the outward journey; second half, the inward journey. And obviously, The Alpha Reset is such a transformational experience for the men, I think because of what, I know it’s because of the release of the guilt and the shame that they get throughout those three days.
Bruce 22:17
That’s really interesting you say that, because I was on one of those a couple of months ago, and it was not only for me, having done some of this work elsewhere, an incredibly powerful experience, but to witness other men, TPM clients, go through a truly profound experience and shed some of that stuff that has been holding them back. And finally be able to look other men in the eye and say, “I’ve now got the confidence to have that awkward conversation with my wife, to go and tell her what I’m really thinking or what I really expect from this relationship.” It was just incredible to see the transformation over a short period of time. It was a very powerful experience for me.
Tim Matthews 23:02
I love it. I love it. I can’t wait to lead the one I’m leading in April. So if you were to give the listeners, right, let’s say they’ve been resonating with your journey, this feeling of shame and realizing, “Hang on a minute, I need to make some changes.” Let’s imagine they’re still in that spot, right, and/or they’re on the journey to making changes, because some of them will be, some of the guys that have been in the movement for a few years. If you were to give them three takeaways, three pieces of advice, and I’m putting you on the spot, what would that be?
Bruce 23:40
I’ve got to think about this. I can think of one so far. So the first one would be: you don’t have to do this alone. Do it with support. I always thought I had to. Really, do it with support. Nobody’s going to reject you for showing up. Well, some people may reject you, but they don’t count. The people who count will not reject you and, in fact, will probably welcome you showing up as a more authentic you. I’m struggling with the third one here. Just do it. Life will be so much sweeter if you do it. Don’t hold yourself back.
Tim Matthews 24:28
Oh, I love that. And that second point as well, I mean, the idea of not doing it right, that’s the third point, I know, but people rejecting you, which was the second point. They won’t reject you, and those that do reject you, because some of them won’t like the changes, that happened to me when I started to really take off the mask I was wearing. Some people left my life because A, because I chose for it to be that way, B, because they chose for it to be that way. But it was much better all around, because prior to that, they were just in a relationship with a version of me that wasn’t even real anyway. So it didn’t serve either person. Exactly. But the people I was left with, the people that I then attracted as well, the people that came into my life from me being authentic, was so much more fulfilling. There’s no way that I would have been able to do what we’ve done in TPM the past 10 years, the people we work with and all the fun stuff that goes with it, had I been who I was. There’s no chance at all. By no means am I a finished article or perfect at all, but I think that point of “people won’t reject you, the people that matter” I think is such a key point, because the idea of shame, toxic shame, “What will people think? There’s something wrong with me. People will leave me,” the fear of abandonment, all sorts, but in my experience, and what I’m hearing you say in your experience, that really is not the case.
Bruce 26:10
That's been my experience, and I couldn't have put it better myself. That fear of the people in my life rejecting me held me back massively, and yet, when I showed up as a better version of myself, more authentic, sure, some people left my life, but my life’s better without them, because there are so many more people who bring richer relationships.
Tim Matthews 26:40
That's the thing, the connection deepens, right? Because you've taken off the mask. You've been vulnerable. They've seen the humanity within you, and like I said, it gives them permission sometimes to then share things that they were holding back. And it's within the vulnerability that the connection happens. And then there was one other point that you said before that I thought was really important, the support piece, that first point. I think that’s really important, because I think part of what feeds the shame is the isolation, is the loneliness. You know, we talk about the five agonies of No Man’s Land in TPM. The first one being greed, the feeling that no matter what you have, it’s never enough. The second one being anger, because it builds a sense of frustration. “What’s wrong with me? Why can’t I fix this?” The third one is shame, because typically you then act out, whether it’s drinking, like you said, whether it’s shouting at the kids, whatever it may be. Then it leads to the fourth one of loneliness, because then the men tend to isolate and pull themselves away, “Well, maybe it’s better if I’m just not around.” And it’s the fifth agony of uncertainty, because it’s like, “Well, I can’t do this forever. Which domino will fall first? Will it be my business, my health, my marriage? What will it be?”
Bruce 27:55
I’m smiling because I’m so familiar with all those agonies. They were such great friends to me earlier in my life. You know, somebody said to me once a couple of years ago, “Bruce, you were a really angry young man.” And I said, “No, I wasn’t.” But the reality, I was. But it was all directed internally.
Tim Matthews 28:16
Wow. I just want to touch on the five virtues, because that’s the opposite of the five agonies. So the first virtue is presence. In order for you to leave the agonies in No Man’s Land, you first have to get present with your experience, what’s really going on for you. Because obviously, the denial of that is what’s leading to the agonies. Exactly. From the presence, if you actually then process what is coming up, it could be emotions, it could be whatever, with support, with men, however you do that, it can lead to the second virtue of peace. You can then start to experience a sense of peace, which usually goes hand in hand with self-acceptance. And there’ll be some self-compassion in there as well. From that second virtue of peace, you move to the third virtue of power. And power is meant in the sense of “I have freedom.” The freedom to be myself, to me, that is the most valuable freedom of all. It’s more valuable than the freedom of money, the freedom of time, the freedom of location. I agree. The freedom to be yourself is just priceless. And that’s where the self-authority comes in. You stop caring as much about what people think. You stop trying to say the right thing. You stop trying to prove yourself, which then leads to the fourth virtue of passion, because energy starts to flow through your life again. You being you, you feel good. You’ve got a nice foundation of peace upon which the power can really rise and thrive. And then you’ve got the fifth virtue, then, of purpose. You then really start to find your path, from speaking your voice, trusting yourself, listening to yourself, your confidence grows, your belief grows, and that’s what we call the Promised Land. So I don’t know if, when we think about your journey, those virtues you experienced on the other side. I’m curious to hear your thoughts.
Bruce 30:15
Some of them are probably further along the journey than others. I certainly have far greater clarity around what my purpose is in life now versus 10 or 20 years ago. I’m not quite sure I’m fully at that place of peace, but I think that’s an ongoing journey. The first one, presence, I certainly think I show up with far greater presence than perhaps I did. I was always distracted, looking over my shoulder, “Who’s going to be saying what about me? How do I need to show up?” Hyper-vigilance. Hyper-vigilance. Whereas now I’m like, “Well, this is who I am. Kind of take it or leave it.” Not in an arrogant way, but that’s acceptance, authenticity. Exactly. Beautiful. But like everything, they’re works in progress.
Tim Matthews 31:09
I mean, just like the agonies can take on a life of their own, you’ll cycle through them. The virtues are the same, right? You’re always going to be working on the presence. And from the presence, you can really get the peace. I mean, without presence, you’re not going to have peace. Exactly, right? And passion, that’s going to ebb and flow. Power, you’re always going to be checking yourself, because there are always tendencies to want to maybe shove things down a little bit at times. I know for me, that can still creep up. I can find myself still shoving things down at times. So the virtues are a journey, right? You know, we have to talk about the journey being the destination.
Bruce 31:48
For me, the power one is I have the power of choice. So I can choose how I show up. I can choose what I want to do or what I choose not to do, and that can be incredibly, I guess that brings some of the peace, and also I get to determine what my life looks like.
Tim Matthews 32:10
It's the opposite of shame, exactly, right? It's the opposite of shame. When you've got that self-acceptance and you're listening to yourself, I think about self-image and self-esteem. You know, the fastest way to lose confidence is to make and break promises to yourself. Exactly. The fastest way to build it is to make and keep promises to yourself. So if you're showing up every day knowing that you want to say something different or do something different, or be someone different, and you're not doing that, you're losing self-esteem. You're going to generate a negative self-image. The converse is also true, to your point, with power, right? Choice, just being myself, it builds self-image, it builds self-esteem. And it’s very much not an external validation thing, which, that’s the trap that a lot of the guys have fallen into when they come to us, right? “Hey, I’m good enough because look at that thing I built,” be it a house or a business. “Look at that thing that I drive, look at that thing that I wear.” There are all these things outside of them that they can point at as evidence, whereas, with the virtues and the path that you are on and switched over to, it’s internal validation. The validation comes from listening to yourself, trusting yourself, being yourself, and again, to me, that’s the freedom to be who you want to be, which is just absolutely priceless.
Bruce 33:37
I couldn’t agree more, Tim. It’s all about what I can do for myself and how I can feel and how I can hold myself accountable rather than externalizing me. If I can internalize me, I can feel better about myself. Otherwise, I’m reliant on everybody else to feel good about myself. And that point you made about accountability, if I show up the way I say I’m going to show up, I know I feel good, and I know that I have a support system in place where if I slip up, either I’ll be aware of it, or if I’m not aware of it, I’ve got a team of supporters who will say, “Bruce, that’s not you. Why don’t you show up better, different?” And then I feel good about myself, whereas if I’m late or I mess up or I don’t keep my word, that’s a circle down into that old shameful place again.
Tim Matthews 34:36
There’s a lot of defensiveness that comes with agonies as well, right? Because low self-esteem can be a thing in that place. It’s difficult then to take feedback, right? Because the shame is so heavy that the last thing you need is more of what feels like criticism or judgment or whatever. The ego is so fragile, and you just can’t take it, right? But equally, on the other path, the path of power, the five virtues, all the things that we talk about, because there’s a much healthier sense of self that gets built through being authentic, like you’ve experienced, there’s a lot more of an open-mindedness and a curiosity to receive feedback, which is the opposite of defensiveness. And at the end of the day, we can’t see our own blind spots, so we need feedback, right? We need, I think, anyway, we need feedback. We need accountability. I certainly do need accountability. I want things to be called out. The last thing I want to do is be around yes-men or yes-people. It frustrates the hell out of me, you know? So, wow, beautiful. We were supposed to talk about legacy, and we went everywhere but authenticity, beautiful.
So guys, you’ve heard it from the man himself, Mr. Bruce Greater. If you’re in a position where you are struggling, you’re feeling that shame, that toxic shame maybe setting in, follow that piece of advice from Bruce, those three steps that he mentioned. The journey is definitely worth it. I know it’s scary. I know it might feel heavy. Whether you reach out to us, whether you reach out to somebody, whoever you reach out to, just reach out to somebody. Don’t continue to lone-wolf it, because you matter, and your journey is important. We’ll see you next time on the TPM show.