Episode #1061
If your wife feels distant or emotionally checked out, you're not alone and it’s not random. In this episode, Doug and Erin talk through why so many women pull back in relationships, especially when men start trying to improve themselves.
You’ll learn what’s really going on underneath the surface (hint: it’s not about her not caring), and how broken trust and lack of emotional safety can make her retreat even when you're trying to do better.
Doug shares a story from a recent men's event where one powerful question helped a husband realize exactly how he’d slipped back into old habits. Erin breaks down the emotional impact this has on women and what makes them feel safe enough to reconnect.
They also cover the simple but powerful shifts men can make—things most guys overlook—that create real change in a relationship. No fluff here. Just honest reflection and practical takeaways you can put into action starting today.
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Erin Holt 0:00
Can’t get hurt again. I can’t have more broken promises again. That just has worn away at my trust.
Doug Holt 0:05
Give me four examples of how you’re not stepping up.
Erin Holt 0:09
There can be a deeper connection than ever that can come. I can’t change Erin, and she can’t change me. Sad, painful, hurt, angry, but underneath it all, it’s just sad and hurt.
Doug Holt 0:19
The first place to check is the trust and safety area.
Erin Holt 0:23
Whatever the thing is, own it, acknowledge it, talk about it, communicate about it.
Doug Holt 0:27
That’s literally the worst-case scenario, you end up being a better person.
Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of The TPM Show. I’m your host, Doug Holt, and once again joined by my beautiful wife, Erin Holt. Thanks for being here.
Erin Holt 0:50
Hey babe, thanks for having me again.
Doug Holt 0:52
I’m glad we have a little more time to jump into something here, something that comes up often. A lot of men complain that their woman seems to be withdrawn. She pulls back, almost like she’s not interested, like she doesn’t care if he’s in the house or not. Let’s talk about that.
Erin Holt 1:24
That’s a hard place to be. We’ve been there before, from both sides, and that just hurts. It hurts to hurt inside a relationship with somebody you love so much. There are so many reasons that can happen, but I actually just talked about this on The Brotherhood call I did.
Let’s just say it’s coming from the place of you, the man, who started doing more work, whether it’s with TPM or elsewhere. You’re changing and following through on things you might have been promising for years, maybe decades. What can happen is, because she feels unsafe and isn’t trusting that this time it’s real, she’ll actually push you away.
She’s had hope so many times only to have it crushed by broken promises. I’m not saying it’s only men who do this, but from a woman’s perspective, that’s why she’s doing it. Broken promises, like saying you’ll stop drinking so much, or start taking care of yourself, or be more present, but then not following through, over and over.
She’s had so much hope and so much hurt that she’s almost bracing for disappointment. So she’ll seem colder, more distant, more withdrawn in the beginning as you’re growing. But I promise you, if you can, lack of a better word, prove to her that she can trust you, that you’re going to follow through on what you say, that you’re in integrity… she’ll soften.
And what happens next is she sees you again in the light she’s always seen deep down, the reason she’s still there. She knows the core of you, even if you haven’t been living from that place. Once she can trust it again, there can be a deeper connection than ever before.
Doug Holt 3:59
Something interesting happened at the Inner Circle event last week. For those who don’t know, the Inner Circle is the next level after The Activation Method or The Ascension Blueprint. It’s invitation only, men who are usually higher net worth, running bigger businesses, playing a bigger game.
We spent two days in wine country at this amazing winery, the first in the U.S., actually. Picture a big boardroom setting surrounded by vineyards. Each man gets 45 minutes for a hot seat, sometimes two hours, to bring up his biggest topic.
One man said his wife had become withdrawn, focused on herself, didn’t seem to care about the relationship. Things were bad. Another man asked him, “Weren’t things good six months ago?” He said, “Yeah, they were.” Then someone asked, “Give me four examples of how you’re not stepping up. Four examples of how you’re not showing up for her.”
To his credit, he listed four clear ways. And those four ways were exactly what he had been doing when things were good. He’d just let them slip. It’s the classic trap, things improve, you relax, and you slide back into old habits.
If he simply reversed those four things, that would be his roadmap to getting his wife back. From her perspective, imagine, she finally sees him showing up, her heart opens, she feels safe again… and then he slides back into the old version of himself. That’s devastating. That’s scary.
Erin Holt 6:34
Super scary. Sad, painful, hurt, angry, but underneath it all, it’s just sad and hurt.
Doug Holt 6:41
Right. And that shows up as her withdrawing and turning inward to protect herself. Talk a little more about that.
Erin Holt 6:50
I know this goes both ways, but talking about what happens inside of women, if we don’t feel safe, we come across to you as closed off, tightened up, hardened. Like you can’t access us. We’re not talking about physical safety here, we’re talking about emotional safety. And honestly, it creates a lot of tension in our bodies. It’s exhausting to live like that. When we feel unsafe with you, it’s like our system locks down. There are many ways that happens.
If, like Doug just said, you fall back into old habits that never fed the relationship, that didn’t feel good for us as your partner, that’s going to make us close down and turn away. I’m not saying that’s the best thing to do, but that’s what happens.
A big thing is integrity. If you’re not your word, if you’re one person at work and another at home, people might say, “Oh, he’s so nice,” but at home you’re prickly, short, mean… That makes us feel unsafe. You’re not in integrity.
Or, if you’re moody all the time and don’t manage your own energy, one day you’re fun and playful, the next you’re mean, the next you’re totally checked out, it feels so unpredictable. We can’t rely on you. We don’t know who we’re going to get, so we protect ourselves from you. Those are pretty big examples.
Doug Holt 8:33
Those are great examples. I think most men don’t really grasp this concept until halfway through The Activation Method. Byron Katie has a process she calls “The Work.” I like her formula, though I probably butcher it, but it’s basically this: take a complaint you have about someone. For example, “My wife is withdrawn.” Then ask, “Is that undeniably true? Is she always withdrawn?”
Well, no, she’s not with our daughter, right? So you move to the next step: turn it around. “I’m withdrawn.” Then write five examples of how you’re withdrawn and five examples of how your wife is not. Every single time, you end up realizing, “Oh crap. Look at my role in this.”
For me, to be in integrity, I can’t complain about something Erin is doing if I’m doing the same thing. Like, “Erin never cleans up after herself.” Is that true? No, she does. Do I always clean up after myself? No, my clothes are literally on the floor right now. So men, start cleaning your side of the street first. That’s the only thing you can control. You can’t change Erin, as much as I’ve tried in the past, I can’t change Erin, and she can’t change me.
But what’s worked for us is that we’ve both focused on changing ourselves first. We can now ask each other for feedback, “How am I experiencing you? How are you experiencing me?”, but most couples aren’t there yet. You’ve got to own your side. I’ve seen marriages go from divorce papers to total turnaround within the first week of The Activation Method. Why? Because the man just shows up. He realizes his part, starts doing his ARS, his Alpha Rise and Shine, and his wife sees that he’s invested his money, his time, and his heart into making things better.
That builds trust. Because he’s doing the work, not just talking about it. And to the guy at the Inner Circle who shared his story, he crushed it. The fact that he was willing to go there, to look at himself, that’s leadership. That’s part of being in integrity.
Erin Holt 11:42
And it gives you so much freedom when you actually do that. Because if you played a role in creating the dynamic, which you did, you also have the power to change it. You can take responsibility and say, “You know what? This is the opposite of what I want to experience in my marriage.”
Doug Holt 12:00
I want to buy you a gift. If your marriage is struggling, and let’s be real, every marriage struggles at some point, but if you’ve lost that love, admiration, and respect, I want to help you.
I’ll buy you a copy of my book, A Man’s Guide on How to Save Your Marriage Without Talking About It. Inside, I’ve distilled over eight years of TPM programs to help men like you bring love and respect back into their homes.
All I ask is you pay the shipping. I’ll buy the book. You can start taking action today. Click the link or find it in the bio and get your copy now.
Erin Holt 12:54
And taking ownership, really asking, “What do I want in my marriage, and what do I have to do to create that?” It’s powerful when you stop outsourcing your happiness to your partner, stop blaming them for what’s not working in your life, and stand on your own two feet. Come to a place where you realize, “I’m responsible for myself in this marriage. My marriage will improve when I’m fully responsible for me as an individual, so that I can be a true partner.”
Doug Holt 13:29
100%. And what’s the worst-case scenario? You end up a better person. That’s literally it, the worst case. Your partner might still leave, but you can’t control that. You can only control your actions. The worst case is you become better. The best case, you become better and your relationship thrives. Your partner rises with you, and together you both keep growing.
Erin Holt 13:56
Exactly. And we’ve said this before, some of the strongest marriages we know, including ours, have gone through the darkest times. Because you have to learn how to heal and repair and grow together, instead of apart. You have to stop being adversarial, stop trying to control each other, and move past fear. It’s about becoming emotionally and relationally mature, so you can finally be the kind of partner you’re proud of.
Doug Holt 14:25
100%. You probably don’t know I do this, but most people where we live have no clue what I do. I don’t go around telling people. If they ask, I’ll give some vague statement. We live in a community where people don’t care what you do for work, which is great.
But I’ll be at a barbecue or something, and a guy will make a comment about his wife, and I’ll just say, “Marriage is easy, huh?” And all the guys look up, shocked, like, wait, am I the only one struggling here? Men don’t talk about it at all. No guy goes to another guy and says, “My marriage is tough right now.” Maybe after some drinks, but usually what happens is guys complain about their wives, put them down, or make jokes at their expense, which is toxic and horrible, but common.
That’s why cleaning up your side of the street is so important. If your wife is withdrawn or pulling away, the first place to check is trust and safety. When we were going through our dark times, if you were pulling away, it pissed me off. Then resentment would build. What worked for me were two things. One of them I teach the guys at TPM. When I saw you hurting and I felt angry, I’d picture the little girl inside of you, the younger you. And I’d remind myself, “I love this woman. I don’t ever want to see her hurt.”
Because so much of it comes down to pride. The story I made up in my head was, “If she’s pulling away, that means I’m not good enough.” That hit my ego and my sense of significance. I’d think, “Why does everyone else think I’m awesome, and she doesn’t? Something must be wrong with her.” But when I started looking at my side of the street and taking responsibility, not for your feelings, but for my actions, it changed everything.
Just like that gentleman in the boardroom, when he said, “Here are four ways I’m not showing up,” it gave him clarity. And just like in business, you need optics to make good decisions. If you don’t have optics in marketing, sales, operations, finance, you’re blindfolded, just hoping to hit the target.
When I took care of myself and did my own work, regardless of what you did, things started to shift. That’s what most men miss: when they do their work, their woman sees it. She doesn’t want to be left behind, she wants to grow with him. And suddenly, he becomes more attractive. I’ve asked you this before: what percentage of women you’ve worked with, or your girlfriends, find a man who’s doing personal development attractive?
Erin Holt 17:55
100%.
Doug Holt 17:58
Exactly, 100%, guys. But most men do it quietly, in secret. They’ll listen to podcasts or read books in the dark, maybe at the gym or while driving.
Erin Holt 18:07
Bring her into it. For whatever reason, some of you keep it secret or wait until things are completely falling apart. You don’t have to wait for rock bottom. You can heal and grow much faster without that. Share it with her. We want to know what’s going on in our man’s world. We want to hear about what you’re learning, your insights, your reflections. It makes us feel closer to you.
Doug Holt 18:37
At TPM, we have programs that range from $250,000 a year all the way down to free, depending on where a man wants to start. A lot of men, if they can, run it through their business since we’re technically a business organization.
And funny enough, some men don’t even tell their wives they joined. One guy I know made a significant investment in one-on-one coaching to save his marriage. When another man asked, “You didn’t tell your wife?” he said, “No, I figured divorce would cost a lot more. I’m pushing all my chips in.”
When his wife found out, she wasn’t mad, she was excited. She was thrilled that he went all-in on them. He wasn’t spending on a car or vacation; he was investing in their future. A lot of guys try to fix things with external stuff, take their wife on a trip, buy her jewelry or gifts, and while that’s nice, it’s not the solution.
Erin Holt 20:06
Just like a baby isn’t going to save your marriage, right? That’s another common one.
Doug Holt 20:09
Exactly. “Let’s have a baby, that’ll fix it.” It won’t. The real fix is investing in yourself. Push all your chips to the center of the table and say, “I’m all in on this marriage.” Not one foot in and one foot out. I was one foot in, one foot out for a while too.
Erin Holt 20:31
So was I. It’s not a good place to be, it doesn’t feel good for either side.
Doug Holt 20:35
Right. And when you’re sitting on that fence, as one guy joked to another in our group, “You must have splinters all over your ass.” You can’t live that way. That same man later committed fully, he’s joining us in Japan this February for our Grounded Masculine Leadership retreat. Epic adventures, deep growth. He decided to show up every day as the best version of himself, for himself first, and then for his wife. That’s what leadership looks like.
Erin Holt 21:25
I find men are actually really good at that. When you get feedback and insight, what you call optics, you take action. You do what it takes to create a different result. And you genuinely love seeing your woman happy and connected.
Doug Holt 21:42
We do. Well, and I love you, so I want you to be happy. I want you to have the best of everything. Selfishly, I get a better house, I get a better lover, right? It also makes me feel like more of a man, that I’m providing, that I’m creating that happiness for us.
We joke around about it, like when you say, “Good movie,” I’ll think, “Yep, I did that.” When I plan a date night and it’s fun, “I did that.” When you plan one and it’s fun, “I did that.” It’s my own internal thing that makes it fun.
So, closing out, what’s going on in a woman’s heart and head when she’s pulling away and the man shuts down? She’s scared. She doesn’t feel safe. And then the man shuts down because he’s resentful, which makes her feel even more scared.
Erin Holt 22:43
Way more scared. Way less safe. And also, like, “I can’t trust him.”
Doug Holt 22:46
So how much sex are they having in that relationship? Nothing, right? And if they are, it’s bad, really bad. She’s doing it because she feels she has to. I always tell guys, when they say, “My wife’s not interested in sex,” I go, “She’s not uninterested in sex, she’s uninterested in sex with you.” At least right now. And you can change that. So let’s go back and forth. What’s one thing a guy can do right now if he’s listening, thinking, “That’s my wife… she’s scared… I hate that feeling”? What’s one thing he can do?
Erin Holt 23:24
The first thing that comes to mind: acknowledge it. Say, “I know you’re scared. I know I said I was going to do this and didn’t follow through.” Whatever the thing is, acknowledge it and clean it up. By bringing it up, you actually reconnect, and the tension dissipates. Ignoring it only builds a moat between you.
Bring up whatever the thing is and say, “I know this caused you hurt. I know it made you feel unsafe or unable to trust me. I want you to know I’m here, and I’m working on this.” Communicate about it.
Doug Holt 24:08
Love it. Call out the elephant in the room. You both know it’s there, might as well bring it up.
Erin Holt 24:13
And it’s really attractive when you’re the one who brings it up first. It just is.
Doug Holt 24:19
I’ll give one more. Do what that gentleman did at the boardroom. He was incredibly self-aware. Ask yourself: what are four ways you’re not showing up for your partner? You can do five if you want, but start with four. Then flip them.
If she walks into your office and you don’t look up, just keep typing and seem annoyed, try instead to stop, look up, and greet her. That’s one small change. Four simple things. Identify four ways you’re not showing up, then reverse them.
Erin Holt 25:02episode
And on that note, it really is the simple things that make the biggest difference. Sure, we all love a great vacation, but it’s the daily things that create the foundation. Research shows that if you’re learning a new skill or flipping a habit, it only takes about 55–60 days to ingrain it. That’s not long, guys. If you want to turn your marriage around or create something better, 60 days is nothing.
Doug Holt 25:36
That’s why this guy’s doing it. We’re holding him accountable until the next event, which will be Japan in February.
Erin Holt 25:45
He’s putting not just his head, but his heart into it and doing something different.
Doug Holt 25:47
There you go, well said. I know you’re heading to the kids’ school now, so go mom it out and take care of the family. Thanks for coming on, as always. It’s awesome to share this space with you, and thank you for what you’re doing for the wives and women out there.
Erin Holt 25:59
Thank you so much for bringing me in.
Doug Holt 26:02
Gentlemen, here’s what I want you to take from this episode, and from what Erin shared today. If your wife feels distant, she’s not cold-hearted. She’s scared. Picture her as that five-year-old little girl who’s frightened.
And you know this, if you saw a scared little girl, you’d do anything to protect her and make her feel safe. Do the same with your wife. Show up even if you’re scared. Figure out those four things, four ways you’re not showing up, and flip them.
And like Erin said, 60 days is not a long time. Stay consistent. If you’re brave, have the conversation with your wife. Say, “I realize you’re hurting and scared, and I’m going to do everything I can to change that. Will you walk this path with me?”
If she says yes, that’s fantastic. Just walk the path. That’s why I do these shows, guys. We’ve done over a thousand episodes to help you get your marriage and your life back. If you’re interested in TPM, check out our programs. They’re proven methodologies, step-by-step systems to help you reconnect with your wife and yourself. You deserve more than average. We’ll see you next time on The TPM Show.